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Fuel Espresso @ IFC

 
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vodkangump



註冊時間: 2008-05-14
文章: 287

發表發表於: 星期二 四月 28, 2009 12:29 pm    文章主題: Fuel Espresso @ IFC 引言回覆

did any Bros visit Fuel Espresso (IFC)?
Only provide coffee drinks, some tea and cakes. Bar-like setting.
Serious coffee making- The coffee brewing is totally visible. I saw the barista disposed 2 cups of espresso and redo them again before serving the customers.

a bit expensive (espresso =$24), but worth to try.

One of the top, personal opinion.
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boblam
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註冊時間: 2007-05-04
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發表發表於: 星期二 四月 28, 2009 2:24 pm    文章主題: 引言回覆

I did a while back

They poured espresso away so much so that it took a lot of time just to get a cup of espress. The other customer just walked away as she couldn't wait any more. I was totally newshocked the first time I'm there, thinking there is something wrong with the machine, ie temperature wasn't right.

It took me about 20 minutes to have and finish the cup and I wasn't lingering there. Over the top is what I would say.

Qualitywise, it's a kind of Italian style though it's much better than those stale bean shop but, IMHO, couldn't match what Indie cafes like Crema/Corridor and Landy offer.

Good and nice deco for sure but the wait will kill you, IMHO. Very Happy

If you like Italian style, Coco Espresso is much better.
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vodkangump



註冊時間: 2008-05-14
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發表發表於: 星期三 四月 29, 2009 1:50 am    文章主題: 引言回覆

boblam 寫到:
I did a while back

They poured espresso away so much so that it took a lot of time just to get a cup of espress. The other customer just walked away as she couldn't wait any more. I was totally newshocked the first time I'm there, thinking there is something wrong with the machine, ie temperature wasn't right.

It took me about 20 minutes to have and finish the cup and I wasn't lingering there. Over the top is what I would say.

Qualitywise, it's a kind of Italian style though it's much better than those stale bean shop but, IMHO, couldn't match what Indie cafes like Crema/Corridor and Landy offer.

Good and nice deco for sure but the wait will kill you, IMHO. Very Happy

If you like Italian style, Coco Espresso is much better.


Our espresso and latte ristretto were brewed by a male westerner, pretty efficiency. I guessed yours were done by a female trainee who appears less skillful. During my visit, all the coffee were prepared by the male barista.

I think they (or the male barista maybe) are serious in coffee making as I quoted he redone espresso shots, and after serving, immediately he checked the water temperature of head group using thermostat quite a while. I don't know whether it is just a kind of easy or routine job of a barista, but, at least I feel he is attentive to his shots and machine. On the other hand, I also have experiences to have some watery espresso served by some other well quoted cafes occasionally. So I think it really depends on the barista and up to personal taste, and it is difficult to compare them.

Coco espresso, yeah, definitely I would try later. thanks.

Don't miss Initial for the local cafe camp. Very Happy
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boblam
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發表發表於: 星期三 四月 29, 2009 5:45 am    文章主題: 引言回覆

vodkangump 寫到:
Our espresso and latte ristretto were brewed by a male westerner, pretty efficiency. I guessed yours were done by a female trainee who appears less skillful. During my visit, all the coffee were prepared by the male barista.


Maybe it's the case my two visits were prepared by female.

One time with caucasian female supervisor (the one that another caucasian female customer walked away after nothing came to her almost five minutes after her order).

The other time was 'supervised' by a caucasian male who just came to give a glance, and quickly turn away for some other duty, kinda like giving approval to the shot. Each drink that was served to me on two different occasion came after 3-4 pull that baristas threw it away.

So, while the girl barista did her jobs, it was sort of approved by caucasians. To me, that does not make any different on nationalities.. It's very consistent to me for both times for what's in the cup, ie good Italian style but not quite match local Indies here.

BTW, Fuel carries two blends, regular and darker one. They used darker one for espresso and the lighter one for milk drink, claiming the acidity will bode well with milk. This is a total opposite of what I read elsewhere as darker roast should typically be used for milk base as its taste is easily to 'punch' through the coffee while you were supposed to feel 'the bean' more with lighter roast without milk to 'mask' the coffee taste. This is what I feel at most Indie cafes in Hong Kong and the US. Of course, they are NZ based...

引言回覆:
Don't miss Initial for the local cafe camp. Very Happy


Seem we have a pole apart opinion.

The most disappointed indie cafe in Hong Kong to me is Initial Cafe. Not that it wasn't good but it should have been much better than what it was from my three different visit there.

For three different occasion, all drinks served to me were so light as if they dilute it with water after brewing. Milk texture never felt velvety to me, a bit sweet from right temperature to way too hot almost scald my mouth. How does it feel, making sure you froth your milk to microfoam consistency then add water. The foam cap felt weak/fragile at best.

The ristretto was unbelievably weak the only thing telling me it's ristretto is the very small volume, ie barely more than half the cup. I thought they misunderstood the order for single espresso so I did order espresso 1 week later. This time, the body of its espresso was so light my french press had more body. IIRC, its ristretto's body is in the same line as espresso from Starbucks.

True, this may due to barista. I had it around three different occasion six months apart on Friday night around 9PM as early as six months ago and as recently a month ago. I don't want to pay/visit again to try to see how they improve, let alone $ I need to pay them to prove the point. Sad
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vodkangump



註冊時間: 2008-05-14
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發表發表於: 星期三 四月 29, 2009 6:52 am    文章主題: 引言回覆

boblam 寫到:
vodkangump 寫到:
Our espresso and latte ristretto were brewed by a male westerner, pretty efficiency. I guessed yours were done by a female trainee who appears less skillful. During my visit, all the coffee were prepared by the male barista.


Maybe it's the case my two visits were prepared by female.

One time with caucasian female supervisor (the one that another caucasian female customer walked away after nothing came to her almost five minutes after her order).

The other time was 'supervised' by a caucasian male who just came to give a glance, and quickly turn away for some other duty, kinda like giving approval to the shot. Each drink that was served to me on two different occasion came after 3-4 pull that baristas threw it away.

So, while the girl barista did her jobs, it was sort of approved by caucasians. To me, that does not make any different on nationalities.. It's very consistent to me for both times for what's in the cup, ie good Italian style but not quite match local Indies here.

BTW, Fuel carries two blends, regular and darker one. They used darker one for espresso and the lighter one for milk drink, claiming the acidity will bode well with milk. This is a total opposite of what I read elsewhere as darker roast should typically be used for milk base as its taste is easily to 'punch' through the coffee while you were supposed to feel 'the bean' more with lighter roast without milk to 'mask' the coffee taste. This is what I feel at most Indie cafes in Hong Kong and the US. Of course, they are NZ based...

引言回覆:
Don't miss Initial for the local cafe camp. Very Happy


Seem we have a pole apart opinion.

The most disappointed indie cafe in Hong Kong to me is Initial Cafe. Not that it wasn't good but it should have been much better than what it was from my three different visit there.

For three different occasion, all drinks served to me were so light as if they dilute it with water after brewing. Milk texture never felt velvety to me, a bit sweet from right temperature to way too hot almost scald my mouth. How does it feel, making sure you froth your milk to microfoam consistency then add water. The foam cap felt weak/fragile at best.

The ristretto was unbelievably weak the only thing telling me it's ristretto is the very small volume, ie barely more than half the cup. I thought they misunderstood the order for single espresso so I did order espresso 1 week later. This time, the body of its espresso was so light my french press had more body. IIRC, its ristretto's body is in the same line as espresso from Starbucks.

True, this may due to barista. I had it around three different occasion six months apart on Friday night around 9PM as early as six months ago and as recently a month ago. I don't want to pay/visit again to try to see how they improve, let alone $ I need to pay them to prove the point. Sad


Haha, we have quite diverse experiences towards Fuel and Initial. Personally I agree that Initial's latte is too milky ( to my own taste) but the espresso is comparable to Crema/Assembly/Corridor ( Landy is not in the same league, can't compare) in term of body. Perhaps too lucky my friends and I were during our visits we got good shots. Laughing


BTW, I know at least one Barista of Initial is a member of this forum, and probably you could reflect your feedback to them.
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boblam
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註冊時間: 2007-05-04
文章: 294

發表發表於: 星期三 四月 29, 2009 10:11 am    文章主題: 引言回覆

Vodkangump.

I think my drinks were prepared by him twice and the last time was via other barista. I though it was his signature to make it weak to begin with but the other barista helped confirm my point.

My complaint does not imply it's not a good cafe but I tell you what I experienced, like comparing note. It's not 100% right or wrong but sharing is what keeps me on this forum... Hahaha

It's actually good if you happen to like it... I think it's a great place and good decor... Too bad, I couldn't motivate myself to go there any more after three disappointed visits... Maybe next year.

Talking about Coco... Its lease will be up for renewal soon and no decision is made yet regarding the continuation... So better go there fast while it's still there

I mentioned Landy as I had espresso there quite a few times, with different beans and all perform really well I wish Landy open cafes. Very Happy Try asking Nelf nicely to pull it for you if he's around and you understand more about Landy's bean...

Talking about Crema, its offday was still significantly better than lots of places. I don't recall any really offday at Corridor/Assembly but there must be some that I haven't found yet.
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vodkangump



註冊時間: 2008-05-14
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發表發表於: 星期三 四月 29, 2009 12:13 pm    文章主題: 引言回覆

boblam 寫到:
Vodkangump.

I think my drinks were prepared by him twice and the last time was via other barista. I though it was his signature to make it weak to begin with but the other barista helped confirm my point.

My complaint does not imply it's not a good cafe but I tell you what I experienced, like comparing note. It's not 100% right or wrong but sharing is what keeps me on this forum... Hahaha

It's actually good if you happen to like it... I think it's a great place and good decor... Too bad, I couldn't motivate myself to go there any more after three disappointed visits... Maybe next year.

Talking about Coco... Its lease will be up for renewal soon and no decision is made yet regarding the continuation... So better go there fast while it's still there

I mentioned Landy as I had espresso there quite a few times, with different beans and all perform really well I wish Landy open cafes. Very Happy Try asking Nelf nicely to pull it for you if he's around and you understand more about Landy's bean...

Talking about Crema, its offday was still significantly better than lots of places. I don't recall any really offday at Corridor/Assembly but there must be some that I haven't found yet.


Boblam,

1. Surely I welcome your sharings. Similarly, I like to share what I really experienced and observed, and it keeps me on this forum too. I really enjoy the experience at Fuel and Initial, and share with Bros here. I open the thread for Fuel as I think it has quite different style from local indie or chain cafes, I can't see any wrong from it.

2. I dislike comparing the cafes and giving ranking openly, as I think it is subject to personal taste and perception. I did come across over-milky latte and watery espresso from your favorite cafes. So I presume the Barista strongly influence the output quality. And I really think I was so lucky to have such good shots during my visits to which I mentioned, wrt your bad experiences. If it sounds offensive, I apologize.

3. I went to Initial actually after seeing this post, and quite some good appreciations from other Bros, not only myself. Naturally I recommended it to you from my own experience as well as what I read. If it touches your bad memory, I apologize.
http://freshcoffeentea.no-ip.info/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=1202&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0


4. I suggest you to feedback to Initial 's Barista, as I treat it is positive for the improvement of the local indie cafe and the Barista who is a friend of the forum.

5. I said Landy is not in the same league, anything wrong? fundamentally they are roaster and not run in the same setting. I know they have superb skill and I have been consistently buying beans from them, thanks for your nice reminder.


Vodkangump
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boblam
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註冊時間: 2007-05-04
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發表發表於: 星期三 四月 29, 2009 2:10 pm    文章主題: 引言回覆

First stop, how come the tone was negative?

Did I offend you?

Don't worry it's all fine for me and I had nothing personal with both you and the cafe. It's great to share both good and bad side.

vodkangump 寫到:

1. Surely I welcome your sharings. Similarly, I like to share what I really experienced and observed, and it keeps me on this forum too. I really enjoy the experience at Fuel and Initial, and share with Bros here. I open the thread for Fuel as I think it has quite different style from local indie or chain cafes, I can't see any wrong from it.


No, there is nothing wrong. Actually, it's great you open the thread. It's good to broaden the horizon of the cafe.

I just jive in my experience. If lots of us went there, they could notice on our findings and help us all.

vodkangump 寫到:
2. I dislike comparing the cafes and giving ranking openly, as I think it is subject to personal taste and perception. I did come across over-milky latte and watery espresso from your favorite cafes. So I presume the Barista strongly influence the output quality. And I really think I was so lucky to have such good shots during my visits to which I mentioned, wrt your bad experiences. If it sounds offensive, I apologize.


I have the opposite view. I always think abt ranking when I start new things. I want something 'easy' to hold on to. Ranking is one of them. Then, you learn a thing or two while you agree/don't agree with the person who ranks.

There is nothing solid here. One could only learn more if you think positively.

Just an aside, I have a friend who loves 'light' coffee and push the lungo button 'twice' on Nespresso machine (ie same amount of single espresso coffee but the 'longer' shot button was pushed twice). I don't know how to call it... maybe extra long lungo shot... He loves it while I was !!!!!! I remember he rated any proper espresso as too strong.

Ranking has its benefit as long as you are specific and clear on why you rank it that way, IMHO.

vodkangump 寫到:
3. I went to Initial actually after seeing this post, and quite some good appreciations from other Bros, not only myself. Naturally I recommended it to you from my own experience as well as what I read. If it touches your bad memory, I apologize.
http://freshcoffeentea.no-ip.info/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=1202&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0


Nothing to apologize here! I'm totally confused. Let me say again, it's great you mention about this place.

In fact, I said somewhere b4 Indie cafe in HK should follow what Fuel did on its decoration. Really nice. However, I found a lower budget way to achieve comfortable setting. It's at Coco Espresso. Pls take a look whether you agree with me. Agree or not doesn't matter.. Sharing is a great thing, I believe.

BTW, that post was around late 2007 to early 2008... Things change fast, particularly regarding coffee scene in Hong Kong.

vodkangump 寫到:
4. I suggest you to feedback to Initial 's Barista, as I treat it is positive for the improvement of the local indie cafe and the Barista who is a friend of the forum.


I wasn't thinking of going back again any time soon. I think he should know it as he read here too (per what you said). I also post it somewhere though I'm much more straight forward here as this is a coffee community so I hope people could take it more. So it's less likely he doesn't know.

One thing is that Initial can't please everybody... Lot of people like it there so he must do sth right. As for me, read the first sentence of this paragraph again.

Also, I hope you're not one of the barista at Initial. I would be very scare to go to that cafe if the owner couldn't take criticism. To me, mind is rather mild, IMHO, and the operator should prepare to take it much more than this if they want to be in business, IMHO.

vodkangump 寫到:
5. I said Landy is not in the same league, anything wrong? fundamentally they are roaster and not run in the same setting. I know they have superb skill and I have been consistently buying beans from them, thanks for your nice reminder.


There is nothing wrong about what you said and I agree. I didn't mention that I don't agree. I just couldn't help myself to mention a good thing if one did it. And Landy did it.

To me, what's in the cup is very important. I don't really care whether one really opens the cafe or not.

Say my house cooks one of the great dishes. I would not let it go when I eat the same dish outside and found it better/worse than what my house cooks. I'll tell my friend about it and if they happen to eat at my place before, they could compare it. Same as at Landy's. I was lucky Landy, Shing, KCKC (I miss this guy), seiyapiccaso and Nelf pulled drink for me on different occasions and they are all good though I like what Nelf did the best. Some of them, like Nelf and cheesecake, get beans from places for me (Paul Bassett beans that I like and Himalayan bean that is very interesting) and other webboard members to taste. It's great and we all could taste beans worldwide. Back to the topic, nothing is wrong to compare to the cafe experience, IMHO. Unless there's a rule saying that THOU SHALL NOT TALK ABOUT LANDY VS. OTHERS, then I will comply. I found none. If there is, let me know.

Very important, take it easy. I didn't mean harm to you and what you said did not offend me. If you think I offend you in someway, sorry about that. People looks and thinks differently. I learn a great deal from talking to various persons, particularly those with opposite ideas. It helps me broaden my thinking....

Hope this is all good and let me know anything that is not clear.

ttyl

Bob

Smile
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vodkangump



註冊時間: 2008-05-14
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發表發表於: 星期三 四月 29, 2009 3:48 pm    文章主題: 引言回覆

it is fine you clarify the points I misinterpret, i apologize.

I have no relationship with Initial or Fuel. Even I had, I don't know your face so No scare. Laughing

vodkangump
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boblam
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發表發表於: 星期五 五月 01, 2009 5:00 am    文章主題: 引言回覆

Never say never again...


I committed a crime this morning by visiting Initial Cafe for the fourth time after a delicious capp and double ristretto at Crema. Coffee at Crema was good even if this was definitely an off day and I prefer Fiona shot than Terry who was at the helm this morning.

Anyway, double espresso I had at Initial today was probably the best I've ever had there. The watery shot was gone though there's very slight bitterness to it.

Unlike progressive cafes I like, ie Crema/Corridor, what's in the cup tasted subtle and less of everything.

Not that it was bad but this is probably the style of the bean as it came from another barista that was not the same as the first two.

I can still feel the 'hollowness' of the cup which seemed to be a signature of the cup here, IMHO.

For me, I prefer this kind of subtle taste at Coco by a significant margin. Even though I think this trip at Initial is the best, I couldn't rate it higher than where it was. The rank for subtle coffee like this is still Coco and Initial, ranking way behind by a significant margin.

BTW, lot of coffee drinker I read about like this style of bean at Initial. Some evern said that it's reminiscent of one of the good bean offered in Australia, Coffee Supreme https://www.coffeesupreme.com/. If this is the case and lots think that the taste is very close, I have one less reason to go to Australia.
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vodkangump



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發表發表於: 星期三 五月 06, 2009 6:08 am    文章主題: 引言回覆

I have few more read by other coffee addicts, and the differences on café ranking are amazing me. Undoubtedly coffee is a devil drink making we guys passionate and subjective. Twisted Evil Twisted Evil
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